SPEAKER_02 0:14

All right, y'all, here we are. Let's go. JC Fowler here with my partner James Wilson Jr. Let's do it. Question to kick it off, brother. What is one sign for you that something is off in a team?

Early Signs A Team Is Off

SPEAKER_01 0:29

I think when the conversations that were meant for a meeting are held in the hallway. Um stuff that's going on in your head. It's the reasoning, it's the assumptions, it's the oh, maybe they're doing this. That's when you know I call that drift language. Uh when that oh, I'm the only one, or or they should have told me about this. When that stuff started ha happening, yeah, definitely team is on the road to somewhere.

SPEAKER_02 1:02

I like that. I think that's what you would say. That's what I would have said. Um, but I'm thinking a sign when something is off in the team for me is when uh the the leader, the person with the authority in the group makes a decision and no one has any questions.

SPEAKER_01 1:20

Yeah, man.

SPEAKER_02 1:21

That I'm like the silence. I'm like, really? Nobody cares? Nothing. That's well, not having spoken from experience, yeah, and having been that leader before. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:34

Oh no. Yeah, and it feels good in the moment, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:37

Like it's like, oh man, I'm I'm leading, I'm the man. Everybody knows I'm the man. What a great idea.

SPEAKER_02 1:42

That's totally it. That's it. All right, here's where we're going today. That's good, man. You can have good people around you and still feel like you're carrying the mission alone. Yeah. You can have meetings, roles, group chats, project boards, and even shared calendars, y'all, and still not have real teamwork.

SPEAKER_00 2:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:01

Because the truth is, proximity is not teamwork. So when the workload is unclear and the worry is unnamed, teams struggle. Yeah. So today we're talking about why teams can feel heavy

Proximity Is Not Teamwork

SPEAKER_02 2:15

and what breaks down when the work and the worry stays hidden.

SPEAKER_01 2:20

So let's let's pull on some of the thread. Uh, that that conversation of proximity is not teamwork. I think that's so uh important because just because people are in the same room doesn't mean they're carrying the same mission, right? Like this is so critical because we we just assume that because we're together, because we uh may have some meetings together and doing some things together that magically we got, oh, we got values, we got this. Magically we're a team. Yeah, we're a team now, right? We're in the same room. No, no, but that's not the case, right? I mean, you I've been in the room with folks I've eaten uh dinner with, but we're not on the same team, right? So so we have to actually think about the contrast between a working group and a team. A working group is really, it's easy to miss this, but a working group just gives updates. Hey, here's what's going on, here's this, right? It's the leaders like, yep, I'm just gonna tell you what's going on. But a real team makes commitments. Is everybody bought in on this? Are we are we actually moving this forward? Working group says, here's what I'm doing. A real team says, here's what we are carrying. Language, it's subtle, but the language, again, gives you so many weeks. There's another sign. There's another sign. There it is. That's that's perfect, man. Yeah, the I and We stuff. Um, I would say the last one is uh a working group protects their turf. This is it's territorial where a real team shares weight. Uh that's that's just so we know that we're carrying the mission together. Like the idea that this is this is mine, right? It's it's mine, mine, my, mine. It's like a little kid. But the idea is as we grow and as we're a team, it's about we, it's ours.

SPEAKER_02 4:05

Yeah, and don't you impede on mine. Yeah, yeah. Um the analogy I love is uh are yeah, are you a working group or are you a team? Or maybe a different way to think about it is are you a golf team or a basketball team? That's good, man. Golf team goes out, gets all their own scores, and yeah, you add them up at the end, and it's great. But we're gonna celebrate the person that did the best. Not that performance shouldn't be rewarded, but golf team, kind of a bunch of islands or a basketball team, even thinking about the the Knicks, man, the Knicks winning the championship. Yeah, I'm not like a huge basketball guy, and they they had some studs. Yeah, yeah, they were a great team. They just they just they weren't the all-star team, they didn't put together, you know, the Mount Rushmore of basketball to figure it out. They had a bunch of guys that were hungry, that's it, humble, and smart. Anyway, that's a whole different podcast. That's good, man. Yeah, golf team versus basketball team. So give give us give us a I'm sure there's a bunch out there, but give us a definition of a team.

SPEAKER_01 5:00

Yeah, I think a working definition for us is a team, a group of people not just working together, but sharing responsibility for the mission. We're sharing responsibility. So, you know, some of the research is pointing back to teams, keep pointing back to clarity, structure, trust, shared responsibility. And what we understand is that good people are not enough if the team doesn't know what they're carrying together.

SPEAKER_02 5:25

I think that's a critical point. You know, some of the nonprofits we worked with, it's like you guys are really nice. Yeah, good people, great mission, great values, I mean convicted people, yeah laying down their life and like terrible at teamwork.

SPEAKER_01 5:43

Not because they're not nice. Yep, not not because they're not good people, right? Right? Or they it's not so it's never I don't think it's often because people are lazy. I don't think it's because people are not good people, I don't think it's because the mission is not important enough. I just think that we often don't realize what we're carrying together.

SPEAKER_02 6:01

Right. And those people can even care about the same mission, yeah. But that together piece is so good. I want to repeat that definition you said. Go for it. A group of people not just working together, but sharing responsibility for the mission. I think that's great working definition.

SPEAKER_00 6:16

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 6:16

All right, so let's let's transition. We talked about from the top workload and worry. And so here's here's the main point. Every team essentially, and you know, there's nuance to this, but every team essentially carries two kinds of weight.

SPEAKER_00 6:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:30

What we'll call workload and worry. Yeah. So here's workload. This should

Workload Versus Worry Defined

SPEAKER_02 6:35

sound familiar. Workload is what needs to get done. We're talking tasks, deadlines, decisions, even the systems, maintaining the systems, the deliverables. That's the workload. Yep. Uh, spoiler alert people are typically way more comfortable talking about the workload. Yeah, man. But doesn't mean they always do. So then there's worry, the second kind of weight. This is what people carry while trying to get it done. It's like the stuff underneath the stuff. The pressure, the fear, the uncertainty, the relational tension. Workload sounds like this. We need to launch this. Yep. We need to hit this deadline. We need to serve these people, we need to reach these people, we need to fix this system, we need to make this decision, we need to move this project along. Yeah. Workload. Yeah. Critical. It's critical. It has to be done. Yep. Rory sounds like this. I'm afraid this will fail. I don't know if we can get this done, if we have enough capacity. Yeah. I feel like I'm the only one thinking about this. I'm not sure I can say this without being misunderstood. I don't know if we have the right people around us. The drift language. Yep. The key is even if the workload is clear, this is why both of these are so essential.

SPEAKER_00 7:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:51

Even if the workload is clear, but the worry remains hidden, teamwork breaks down. Yeah. And we become that golf team again. And if you've had an experience on a team where you're like, oh yeah, no, we get the work, it's totally great, but we don't talk about anything else. Yeah. We never name the worry, the weight underneath it. There's there becomes a distance which breaks down trust. And you can't really create synergy if you aren't if it you aren't engaging with it all.

SPEAKER_01 8:18

Yeah, no, that's real, man. I love that because it is it is just so true. Like we we're talking about drifting, and I think I almost we'll probably hit it on the next podcast, but I really love that language is that it never is all of a sudden. It's never loud, it's never like, oh boom, we know this is not working. No, it's subtle, it's the it's the repeated moments of unclear work and unnamed worry. And usually it's like, oh, we've drifted. Yeah, that drifting leads to disconnection. Right. And that disconnection leads to mistrust, right? It's just and poor performance.

SPEAKER_02 8:53

Poor performance. Yeah, I love the how did we get here? It's kind of like uh a marriage. I mean, I would say a marriage is like the ultimate team of a partnership, if you will, where like you and I being married to each other. That's right in the special consulting. I mean, that's that's real. That's right. Uh, but yeah, like how did we get here? Which I think, you know, to our credit, I guess I'm tooting our own horn. We have been really good at servicing the worry. Yeah. The workload, yeah, great. Let's get after it. But oh, here's the worry, here's my worry. Oh, really? I didn't know you were thinking about that. Let's lean in a little bit more because here's a buzzword though. Hit this buzzword. All right, go for it. We can't we can't move on. Psychological safety. Oh big buzzword. It is important, not important. Can you give us some clarity around it?

SPEAKER_01 9:35

I think that psychological safety is key to a working relationship.

Drift And The Slow Team Breakdown

SPEAKER_01 9:40

Like if I don't feel safe with you, I it's gonna be very difficult for me to perform, right? Because I'm instead of actually doing the work, I'm actually managing uh my I'm managing our emotions. So I'll put it this way it is you have a manager or a leader who doesn't realize, hey, um, I'm just making all these decisions, nobody's saying anything, and I wonder if behind it they're afraid. Right, right. So you can't lead people that you're afraid of, and you can't lead often in systems where you're afraid. Right. Right. So so psychological safety is saying anytime there's times for review or evaluation, if I'm now sweating, I'm getting anxiety attacks, I'm having all these panic stuff. It's like something is going on in this organization that we really haven't given credit to, and people aren't psychologically safe. And so what it's going to do is it's gonna actually stop our momentum. It's gonna stop actually the mission because it's a name worry, yeah. But now it's it's it's kind of been so so big, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_02 10:41

I think that is such a great uh litmus test for do you have psychological safety? What what what is the degree of anxiety or uh fear, worry, whatever going into a performance eval?

SPEAKER_01 10:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:57

Are you like, am I oh, is this gonna be a surprise? I have no idea. Or have you been have you been naming this stuff all along? And it's more gonna be like a recap and just a just for the um uh uh designated time to talk about it. I'm I'm someone who when someone says psychological safety, I'm like, that's kind of oh, okay, you know. I can see that. I can see

Psychological Safety And Real Talk

SPEAKER_02 11:19

that right and but but I see the value in it, one just as like uh we care for real people. That's it. Period. That's it. And if you want to move the mission forward and you want to be efficient and effective as possible and get to the best decisions possible and make sure that everyone feels committed on the team because they feel free to actually voice their opinion, it's like psychological safety isn't like, oh, I'm I'm afraid someone's gonna hurt me. Yes, no, it's I mean, it could be, which is a real extreme example. Yeah, but most of the time it's subtle, like you said. It's like, well, I think you know, people might think differently of me if I voice this. I think people might think I'm weak if I voice this. I think people might think I'm incompetent if I ask for help. Uh, I think if I disagree with that person, they're gonna hold it against me, and then there's gonna be politicking in the office where how people are talking about you in a different room is different than how they talk to your face. It's like, so what do you do? Well, you you put distance between you, but how can you share responsibility if you're at a distance?

SPEAKER_01 12:19

You know, so so you pulled on this thread, but I I keep thinking about it. Where, again, maybe for some people it feels like this is zoomed out, like I'm not leading an organization that's blah, blah, blah. But as you think about just again, interpersonal relationships, I just think about something as simple as my daughters, if they're afraid to talk to me about the hard stuff, because they they know, oh, in the past, dad's gonna react this way, or dad's gonna what that is, is it's a breakdown of psychological safety. The same deal with my wife. It's like, if we can't have harder conversations because she knows, oh, James is gonna lose it, or oh, I I feel like this is gonna happen because I know that at the end of this conversation, at the end of the day, like we're still going to be together. Like that's that's the that's the that's the key of psychological safety. You and I have navigated some of that. At the end of this conversation, the goal is not to cut you down, the goal is not to make you feel bad, the goal is not that I be vindicated, the goal is that we can actually have a healthier working relationship.

SPEAKER_02 13:22

Yeah, we can grow together. I'm happy you said that. I was thinking about that when we were doing some of the prep that, yeah, even if you're not leading a team, you still have relationships. And if you're if you're if you're doing all your work on an island, uh, we need to address. Yeah, let's upgrade you. Yeah, you need an upgrade. We need to start getting some confidence, some thought partners. It doesn't have to be anything formal. But yeah, this totally everything we're saying applies to relationships. When we take people through some of these assessments and coaching, it's like when we talk about work, yeah, we we typically focus in on the mission-driven business, on the organization, and absolutely. But work gets done if you're volunteering somewhere, if you're in a romantic relationship, a marriage, if you're leading a family, planning a vacation with friends, whatever it is. It's like, oh, workload, worry, where we at? Let's do it.

SPEAKER_01 14:12

So let's lean in a little bit because we've been we've been kind of circling this, uh, but I want to kind of lean in a little bit more in terms of what breaks down the teams. And so we've shared, right? Unclear work and unnamed worry. So let me just give some some some context to it. What is the breakdown number one is unclear work. Unclear work. Nobody knows who owns what, right? Nobody knows

Unclear Work And Its Symptoms

SPEAKER_01 14:34

what success looks like or what matters most. And so this is important because what we often see are the symptoms, but behind the symptom is I really don't have a clue of what I'm doing here. I don't know. It's not clear. I thought, I thought you were I thought well, I didn't know. But I I was doing this right I'm the only one. He don't really care about me.

SPEAKER_02 14:56

Like, oh, well, they're an idiot. Or or what am I? They're gonna think I'm dumb.

SPEAKER_01 14:59

You know, like that's it. That's it, man. So here's some of the symptoms we were recognizing. It's drop balls. It's like, whoa, I thought you were gonna get that done and it didn't happen. Too many meetings, right? So we we again to try to solve a work problem, we add more work and not realizing, no, we got to deal with something beneath the surface. People waiting for permission. That's often, you can be in a culture that says, oh, we're we're all about yes, and we're all about going forward. Innovate, take risks. Yeah, yeah. But if people aren't, you have to pull back the layer and say, Oh, why are they waiting for my permission? Um, leader is the bottleneck often. The leader is the bottleneck, is that we can't make decisions because we know at some point you're gonna have this brilliant idea, and then we now have to adjust to that brilliant idea instead of what we already said we were gonna be committed to. Right. Right?

SPEAKER_02 15:50

So one just thinking about some of those symptoms. The one symptom that always gets me, and I know it's like I'm like, oh, I didn't lead well, is when people do duplicate work. I'm like, you're saying we both did it the same work, and not to like get to good work, but I'm like, right, right, right. We both wasted two hours, two hours. Like, I did that, you did that, dude. That we're both being paid. That's like my button. And we both are doing the same work. Why? Like, so oh, you make $70 an hour. So now that project cost us uh $300 for those two. That's it. That's it.

SPEAKER_01 16:23

Anyway, yeah, no, so some of this stuff that we gotta pay attention to is maybe a simple way of doing is is if you went around the room and wrote down your responsibilities, you might be surprised at how different they actually nah, nah, no, we know.

SPEAKER_02 16:36

Nah, we know. No, we know. I don't know, we don't love sitting with the team and doing that because everyone's like, no, no, no, we know. And then what'd you what'd you what'd you write on yours? Wait a second. I thought I did that. Oh, you're the one who does that? Even gratitude could surface in that space. Yeah, not just that confusion.

SPEAKER_01 16:53

No, that's really good, man, because we we just we just assume, right? We assume, and a lot of leaders, we assume that the work is clear. Here the danger is that oh, I'm an effective communicator. I mean, I'm I've studied on this stage and I've done this and I've said this. And so I just assume that when I'm in a room with the team, that they know exactly what's going on, that the work is clear, because it's clear in my head, it's on my to-do list, it's not on yours.

SPEAKER_02 18:51

You ever walk out of a room to be like, well, I don't like man, everyone's inspired, and no one knows what they're supposed to do. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 18:58

Absolutely. We we had I mean, dude, that's I mean, I I hate to admit, I've had tons of meetings like that where I'm I leave like, oh, this is so awesome a week later.

SPEAKER_00 19:08

We didn't do anything. What are we supposed to do? What are we supposed to be doing?

SPEAKER_01 19:11

No, I love it. And so I think I think the breakdown, right, is this unclear work, but what also spills out of that, and probably what we're we're hitting on, is unname worry, right? This this is so important for teams to really look at. It's the unnamed worry. So the reality is if we were all just machines, then everything we read about in our leadership textbooks, everything we hear on podcasts would work just like that. It would work. Like everything we're even telling y'all, just just do it. Implement, right? But the reality is we're not robots, we're not machines, we're people, we're human beings, and we are complex. Yeah, you hear that AI? We're people, we're people. Stop taking my I mean, and now that's a whole nother conversation. AI is, yeah, that's different. But the helpful tool. It is a helpful tool. Okay, and so, and that's the that's a whole nother conversation. When we start treating people like tools and not like people, we we miss things because the reality is people carry real fears. Yeah, people carry uncertainty, people carry disagreement, people carry frustration, and oftentimes it never gets named. This this is really, and you you asked me this earlier, but what we see here is that this is the hallway conversations start actually surfacing

Unnamed Worry Leaks Outside Meetings

SPEAKER_01 20:30

things that the meeting was designed to hold and surface. And what happens is you've got these side conversations, right? What oh I man, he he he they don't really care about us, or you didn't, I don't think about this, or it's the passive aggressive comments under the breath. Oh, yeah, yeah. Under what you just say to the person.

SPEAKER_00 20:48

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 20:49

And oh, dude, I talk about uh hot buttons. You're leading a meeting and you got a group, and somebody's got this little inside joke thing going, and nobody else knows what's going on. Like, wait, so what's what's so what I often would say is hey, I I want to join in. Like, tell me tell me what's going on.

SPEAKER_00 21:09

I like laughing. I like laughing.

SPEAKER_01 21:12

But it's the it's the passive aggressive comments.

SPEAKER_02 21:17

Maybe that's passive aggressive comments. Maybe it is. I think it is, right?

SPEAKER_01 21:21

Some of it also the symptom is emotional withdrawal, right? Uh we we saw this so many years, right? It's it's the quiet quitting. So you leaders pay attention to this that not everybody's going to respond to pressure the same way. Um, some leaders will be a little bit more vocal about it. Other leaders on your team will actually just withdraw. So that person who used to be contributing a lot, now all of a sudden they're not. You need to pay attention to say, what's going on? Again, in a personal relationship, we used to spend time on the phone talking all the time, right? Or in hours and hours and hours. And then all of a sudden, man, I don't we haven't talked in a little bit.

SPEAKER_02 22:02

People often will opt out rather than engage in the conflict, especially if the environment or the sort of culture that's been set isn't lending itself to having those discussions. It's like man, so-and-so never calls me anymore. It's like, well, actually, uh, you there are all these things that weren't surfaced that they didn't feel comfortable to surface, so it's easier for them just to walk away. I'm just gonna walk away. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:27

Because I want to, I'm, I wanna protect you. You hear people say, I just was trying to protect you.

SPEAKER_00 22:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:32

Um, actually, I was protecting myself. Right. But I was trying to protect you. So other things that show up, right? It's over controlling. Um, now, because I've got this worry, I've got to now, I've got to do damage control. I've got to, I've got to make sure that everybody's on the same page. So I'm I'm now forcing people to say, Oh, you gotta, are we on the same page? We on the uh no, but we're gonna move forward anyway, right? Um, I think the other one that is so, so easy to do, somewhat of the passive aggressiveness, I'm guilty of this. Um, it is when you kind of do a pulse check of the room and everybody said, Yeah, I'm fine. You're dishonest. It's actually dishonest, but you need that psychological safety. And if there isn't a culture of names, that's yeah, wow. Yeah, yeah. So what does not get named in the room usually leaks outside the room. And you so so when you're leading an organization, um, in our cases, leading organizations that are nonprofit organizations, and those uh organizations have ripples. So you're not just dealing with the staff, but you're dealing with the staff that actually has impact on other people. And so what happens is because there's things that go unnamed in the room, we We've been sitting in our ivory tower having so many conversations, but not the right conversation. Now everybody else has been like, Oh, well, I thought it was and I thought we were doing, and then we go back and like, wait, we're not on the same page. You, you, wait, where'd you hear about this this tension? I didn't nobody told me, right? So, yeah, it it's uh we we could have a whole episode about that, man. But a lot of leaders bring their plan but not their pressure, and so they bring updates without concern, and so what you want to think through is that they can tell people what to do, but also not tell the truth, to your point. We've got to figure out how to be honest in these meetings.

SPEAKER_02 24:25

I'm thinking about the ROI, the return on investment for clear work and named worry, or the the implications and impact for turnover. Yeah, people can't stand ambiguity. Yeah, and one of the ways, one of the tried and true ways research says to drive engagement is that they know they're winning. Yeah, they know that their work is having an impact. And so if the work is unclear, you're gonna have ambiguity, which people typically opt out of, and they're not gonna know that they're winning, so they're not gonna be engaged. If you want unnamed worry, people are gonna be anonymous and that stuff is gonna bubble up. And again, the quiet quitting or the just I'm not gonna do it. I'm gonna find another job where I don't have to deal with all this pressure, all this stuff that I can't name. I don't feel safe here. And if that safe language doesn't resonate with you, it's like, I don't feel like I could be real here. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:16

Yeah, I don't feel like I can be real, I don't feel like I'm adding value. What's the purpose? Like, why am I here? Like, yeah, right. That's a lot, man. That's good.

SPEAKER_02 25:24

That teamwork is so important. It's critical, dude. We think about turnover as like, oh, we didn't pay them enough, or we didn't have very benefits, or we need a ping pong table in the bathroom. I'm like, sure, I like ping pong. However, you make the work clear and you let the warriors be named, you're gonna have people run it for you faster. Absolutely. All right, we want to get

The Wrong Fixes That Create Drag

SPEAKER_02 25:42

really practical next episode and get into some of the solutions. Absolutely. Before we go there, we want to finish off uh today thinking about what are some of the common traps that teams get stuck in, or a different way to say that is what are some of the wrong fixes or the wrong ways of thinking about how do I overcome unclear work and this unnamed worry? So the first one, and this might be even the most popular one, uh, we just need to communicate more. Okay. Uh communication, important. Yeah, keep repeating. I think that's important. But a better way to think about that would be we don't need to just communicate more, we need to communicate what matters. Yeah. Expectations, decisions, timelines, tension, ownership. What's the worry? Yep. So that's one. We don't we need we just need to communicate more. No, we need to communicate what matters.

SPEAKER_01 26:33

Dude, and I know we're run out of time, but I just think about one of the quick fixes that we've been able to even help leaders do is just thinking through your staff meeting. Yeah. Like what does your weekly staff meeting look like? I'll I'll just leave it there. But that that that can change so much. Just everything.

SPEAKER_02 26:51

But I wrote a note and said we gotta do a whole podcast on meetings. Okay, all right. To we just need to trust each other. Okay, true. However, the shift is here's what's better understanding that trust is built through these small, consistent, repeated moments of truth, the follow-through, the repair, the actual shared responsibility. So, oh well, we just need to trust each other. I don't know anyone who has trusted someone more because someone said we just need to trust each other, as opposed to, hey, let's put the work in in these small, repeated actions. Yeah, give me a reason to trust you. Give me a reason. And then last one we'll lift up, and there's there's plenty more. Uh, okay, well, we need to collaborate on everything. And you got some of your leaders trying to carry responsibility and giving away responsibility. I have felt this before. Like, well, can we just do it together? And I'm like, Well, it depends. And yeah, but that's your job. I heard um, do you know the name of the guy who wrote the coaching habit?

SPEAKER_01 27:48

Uh is it some Michael something?

SPEAKER_02 27:50

Yeah, well, anyway, coaching habit, amazing book. Yeah, he was on podcast with Carrot Newhoff. Um, and he he said one of his core tenants as a leader is that he's lazy. I'm like, you know, I start listening. Lazy, lazy in a leader. He says he doesn't let people, he doesn't let like his direct reports put their work back on him. Like, I won't do your work for you because that doesn't ultimately serve you in order to serve the mission. And so, oh, we need to collaborate on everything. No, here's what's better understanding collaboration is good, but not everything needs collaborate collaboration. Some things need clarity or honesty, some things need defined ownership, some things need some shared wisdom in the room, and too much collaboration, it creates drag. It just creates drag.

SPEAKER_00 28:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:36

So let's round this out back back to this land of plane here, back to the leadership definition. Again, this is a working definition, and we we just want to make it short, concise. A team, sorry, a team definition. A team is a group of people not just working together, yeah. They do need to be working together, yep, but sharing actual responsibility for the mission. Yep. And maybe another way to say it would be this teamwork is honest alignment around meaningful work. And again, I think that honest is so important.

SPEAKER_01 29:09

That's key, man. Well, well, let's kind of land the plane here, man. What's the crossing of threshold for this week? So here it is. Number one is what work am I carrying that needs to be clarified? Just want you to take a few minutes. Remember, we're we're saying you don't have to solve it all, but you do want to take the very next step. And so here it is. Question number one is what work am I carrying that needs to be clarified? And number two, here's another question is what worry am I carrying that needs to be named? Very simple. What work needs to be clarified? What worry needs to be named? Yeah, and if you have a team, you could ask them those questions. Very easy.

SPEAKER_02 29:43

So good.

SPEAKER_01 29:44

And the reality is, as we kind of end this off, you may not be lacking a team. You may just be lacking shared language for the weight you're carrying.

SPEAKER_02 29:54

That's good. And I would say teamwork begins when the work and the worry is no longer carried alone. It's good. It's good. So we want to invite you into we have a resource we think you'll love. If this podcast uh added value to you, it's called Thresold Thoughts. It's a bi-monthly uh email, uh, quick leadership win in under two minutes. Um we have gotten some great feedback around it,

Two Questions To Reset

SPEAKER_02 30:21

and it is just our way of adding some value for fun and for free. Uh, if that interests you, if you want to, if you want every other week to get a quick leadership win in your inbox, uh just email us at hello at cttleadership.com. You could literally just email us, email list, threshold thoughts, whatever, or say hi and tell us how this episode spoke to you. But we'd love to get that to you. Next episode, we're getting practical and we are gonna unpack uh we're gonna unpack a time tested team reset. All right, until next time. Till next time, see y'all.